slopes's Profile

  • Dec 31, 1969
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Latest comments made by: slopes

  • An interesting article Gregory. As a designer, I actually grow more depressed with each new release Mac OS X. Apple, it seems, has become something of a split personality - with its hardware continuing to embrace the original company �minimalist/functional� philosophy in ways which never fail to surprise and delight us, whilst its software (and I particularly mean its OS) has been seduced onto the long slippery road of adorning every inch of the screen with useless �corporate� eye candy. As the direct result of this, my work flow has slowed down to the point where I now feel the machine wants to be the master of me - rather than the familiar OS 7,8,9 sense that I was very much master of my machine. With OS X, I have to take the UI �prettiness� into account on everything I do - it has become an obstacle. Whereas Apple�s previous interfaces were built to serve one direct purpose - to be perceived as �invisible�, practical tools to facilitate the work of a user. I think it would be a distraction to focus too closely on the merits of Quark versus InDesign here as they both - along with all other Applications - are stuck with using the Mac GUI elements Apple supplied them with. The problem isn�t so much how well these Apps function in relation to each other - it�s how poorly they function measured against the world of OS 9. There has been a misunderstanding on this site (as there has in many other similar discussions) between the more �design� orientated Mac users who have traditionally made up the platform�s solid core and the programming/systems/IT community. The techies seem to mis-read the designer�s call for a return to simple, clean and visually-neutral functionality as a demand that Apple remove from its new OS all the technological advances the company has made. For the technical-minded - and, I would guess in most cases, the visually illiterate - developments in the number of �nice� things an OS can actually do MUST go hand-in-hand with an ever-increasing quota of �nice� visual representations to support this progress. It�s as if the benefits of OS X would (for them) be less meaningful without the reassuring crutch of additional and increasingly fantastical eye candy. The problem the designer (as designer) can see - and any user familiar with old and new environments might sense - is that a price has to be paid for each and every additional bit of on-screen prettiness added to OS X. All the unnecessary, inappropriate, ephemeral, �gunk� Apple heap on to its GUI, and by extension the Applications which must use it, requires extra visual processing from the user - who is required to mentally organise, make sense of, and interact with, each piece of information in front of him and how these (often in the case of OS X, unrepresentitive) elements relate to each other. This, of course, is before he can even think about getting on with the very reason he is using the computer... to make sense of and organise his own work... or in other words... to be creative. It is without doubt that - with the GUI - Apple invented the wheel. Perhaps it�s part of the evolutionary process that the company is now searching for new places to take this still-nascent technology. Hopefully it wont be long before they realise that adding polished chrome hubcaps, inlaid white-walled trim, �go-faster� stripes, 3D logos on everything etc etc, rather than improving performance, actually weighs down the tool to the point where all its kitsch becomes a serious obstacle.
    slopes had this to say on Mar 29, 2005 Posts: 17
    Mac OS 7.5: Better than Tiger Will Ever Be
  • Nathan. I use a number of tools to reduce the unwanted OS X eye-candy clutter. WindowShade is very useful, it reintroduces collapsible windows (essential!) and also allows you to reduce - or even completely remove - all that feathered drop-shadowing Apple love to heap onto everything. There is even a feature to allow some level of fading background windows - which worked so perfectly in OS 9. Another essential piece of shareware is 'DockBlock' which sits on the menubar and enables you to completely quit (and relaunch) the Dock - thereby freeing your Desktop work area of this ugly 'toy box' so you can actually get on with some work... Of course Apple should have made the Dock an application (there is a hack where you can return it to being the app it actually is). I often use ShapeShifter - which is the OS X equivalent of Kaleidoscope. There are a couple of beautiful 'themes' available which offer 'serious' users the chance to return their system-wide GUI to being simple, restrained and dignified - the aim of their creators is to show what a sharp, business-like OS 9 MIGHT have looked like if Apple had modernised it - rather than releasing the dumbed down appearance of OS X. All this stuff may slow down screen redraws, but the benefits of working in a 'sober' environment far outweigh this and you actually find your work and navigation speeds increase significantly.
  • OK Jeff, let's draw a line there. You're right, we're having two discussions in one (the speed/response issue and the Finder/GUI issue). At least you've acknowledged that the OS 9 GUI was more responsive - which was my point all along. You are ignoring many of my GUI points - especially as you know I haven't based my criticisms ONLY on colour - so I'm beginning to feel I'm not going to gain much ground with you on that one. As for the Finder, maybe Nathan will find a third party developer and give those of us who prefer working with a traditional Mac type Desktop the chance to have one (in its fullest sense) when Tiger arrives.
  • Jeff - I kind of figured that you are an IT admin guy. That makes our relationship one of a user (ME) and of a mechanic (YOU). Now I haven�t a clue what goes on under the hood (that�s your job), all I know is that I want a responsive, fast, and concise OS to get my work done on. And from my experience of both systems, OS 9 is much better at achieving this (so far) than OS X is (regardless of OS X�s acknowledged good points). The only shortcoming of OS 9 is that it�s being phased out before something anywhere near as good is ready to replace it. I prefer the speed of the occasionally crashing Porsche to the �safe� hesitant Bread Truck. To me (as a user) the Chooser was fine. The Trash I�ve already dealt with. I don�t remember hearing that many problems about where the Fonts were kept (but hey, keep them where you like it doesn�t really matter to me). As mentioned in the �Spacial Finder� article linked above, I love my Desktop to be a reliable surface, cluttered with whatever Folders I choose, placed where I choose, containing whatever objects I choose - that�s no different to real-life experiences and contributes enormously to the efficiency at which I work. You know, I don�t REALLY mind if Apple heap on as much eye-candy as they like (bring on the pretend brushed metal and Christmas tree lights) as long as that which it�s placed on works as well as its predecessor in the way I want it to. As a mechanic, your job is to help me get the OS performance I�ve had, I�ve liked, and I want - rather than spending so much energy trying to convince me that something which (in many ways important to me) offers such an obviously inferior experience, is actually better for me.
  • Jeff - whether or not you think I�m genuine is something you�ll have to work out for yourself. It strikes me I�m being genuine when I address my thoughts and ideas directly to the person I want to hear them - rather than furtively using a third party. Anyway, I�ll to attempt to answer your concerns. From all your replies - both in this and the previous article - I get the impression you�re not really a busy Mac user. People who use Macs seem to fall into two groups - those who use them as tools for creating (producers) and those who use them as a receptacle (consumers). It seems to me from the all examples you�ve provided of what want from a �good computer� - looking at pictures of your dog, downloading from the internet, listening the your Bach records, helping your old Dad open his emails and dabbling around with UNIX command shells (whatever they are) - you fall very much in the second camp. For those of us who are in the daily hothouse of leaping between QuarkXpress, Illustrator, Photoshop, Word, GoLive etc, creating and hammering out our work for busy deadlines, the appalling inability of the OS X Finder to simply update itself as I save, replace, export, open all my various files (like OS 9, OS 8, and OS 7 used to do) is a VERY REAL frustration. Your being puzzled over anyone having a preference for the simple grey GUI of OS 9 also appears to reveal your lack of any broad experience of the Mac platform as a creative tool and its user-base. When used in a design sense, the words �Functional� and �Minimal� usually refer to absence of decoration, simplification of form, or the smallest amount or degree of formal elements needed to make an object useful. �People who stare at their computer all day long� (if they are working) are usually staring at their work which is the focal point of their concentration - so they don�t really want Apple competing with them on all fronts by throwing in distractions such as bits of 1980�s brushed-metal effect here, a few sets of 3D traffic-light effects there, over-the-top drop shadows around everything, throbbing 3D liquid buttons, stripy boxes all over the place, plastic window strips (if you�re lucky), multi-coloured folder labels stretching across your finder windows, bevels on everything, psychotic Docks, etc etc etc. Mac OS 9 GUI was decorated too of course - to the point of austerity. Because the people who made it had the sense (and the self belief) to KNOW that a good GUI should very much sit in the background and play second fiddle to a user�s work. Any decoration they added to the neutrally colour-valued GUI was minimal and there for a PURPOSE - to provide a helpful visual prompt as to the function of the element it was applied to. Perhaps you should give it a go Jeff - it might make your dogs look even more attractive.
  • Mark - you don't have to be such an Apple apologist. Perhaps my point wasn't clear to you. I meant that the poorly designed OS X Finder windows don't update EVER unless and until you click back into them. If Apple offered to sell you a MK2 version of its sports car with brakes which only took effect after a four second delay - and told you not to make a fuss as 'good drivers' will always find a work-around - would you buy it? If you have some counter arguments to make then do so. If you've exhausted any valid contribution, then it's best not to fall back on trying to sabotage the discussion through personal insults.
  • Nathan - John Siracusa's article is a very interesting one (which I am familiar with). His lucid introductory overview of the Mac GUI is based very much on (or holds remarkable similarities to) the seminal work done in the 1940�s and 50�s by British psychologist D.W. Winnicott. Winnicott developed a theory of �Object Relations� after closely observing young infants in an effort to discover the root process of ALL human interaction with its external environment. He was interested in what made these interactions successful - leading to stimulated child/adult who develops a capacity to fully organise, manipulate, and take responsibility for his own environment; or what makes the interactions fail - leading to despondency, frustration, and dependency on his environment. What Winnicott discovered is that all our objects must remain inert - meaning that they must be felt by the child to have no life of their own beyond that of what he invests in them through his own will and action - initially through the process of �play� which, if successful, carries on through into his adult �working� life (ie: organising, grouping, transforming, placing etc). Winnicott found that one of the main obstacles to the success of this �project� is either a �not good enough� parent (unable to participate) or a �too good� parent (over participating). Of course for our discussion here - as we debate how our virtual objects can best be used within the computing environment - we can replace the word �parent� with �Operating System� (after all both, in different areas of our life, represent authorities). If Apple is going to insist on becoming the �over-participating parent' by removing the dependable inert space we rely on to naturally interact with our objects, and if the company demands it takes control of (or interferes with) how we choose to arrange those objects... or even if we can meaningfully take the responsibility of arranging them at all..., then Apple (like an errant, do-gooding, and attention seeking (read: �eye-candy�) parent) is heading for real problems.
  • Good idea Mark. Maybe at the same time we can ask Apple to �Self-Repair� OS X�s Finder Windows so that they �live-update� - like the old OS 9 ones did... after all they�ve only had five years to implement this basic function. Of course, when I worked in applications on the speedy OS 9 GUI my background Finder lists were INSTANTLY updated each time I saved or exported a document - a great way to keep an eye on work in progress, file orders etc. Sadly, these days, Apple is so preoccupied with heaping every sort of inconsistent eye-candy onto its current GUI that the company seems to have overlooked including such an obvious, straightforward - and essential - feature. RESULT? Save a file... nothing Glance over at the Finder window 2 hours (and many Saves) later... nothing Click onto the Desktop... nothing Click into that Finder window... noth... oh wait a minute! Finder has a little think about it... Finder creates TWO identical icons of the saved file which sit there for a while (take your time boys, I�ve only got a deadline to meet) The whole directory shuffles around and reorganises itself... HEY! finally it�s updated. The consequence of this particularly sluggish aspect of the OS X GUI is that I frequently not only open the wrong files but also launch the wrong applications those wrong files were created in. The problem being - I�m so used to working seamlessly with the immediate system-wide responses of OS 9, so this little �wait-and-see� cat and mouse game the OS X Finder likes to play always trips me up (and of course, throws yet another �X� spanner into my work routine). I suppose had it not been for OS 9 this (along with many other examples) could just be written off as a sort of limitation of Mac technology... something that Apple might one day improve. But after all this time, I wonder if they can be bothered?
  • To Winterbear, You don�t say if you were involved in the Human Interface Team at Apple - it sounds, from your knowledge, that you might have been. But I�d like any one of those experts to know that their many hours of hard work did not go unappreciated. OS 9 had a superb, refined, highly tuned and intuitive GUI which �drove� like a Ferrari. I�ve been on its replacement for nine months now (by far enough time to internalise its routines) and I can say, in comparison, it handles like the local bread-delivery-truck (albeit a heavily decorated one). I have to return to my old G3 every once in a while to use certain software/hardware configurations. Each time I do I am reminded - with a mixture of pleasure and pain - of what a beautifully responsive and well-crafted tool the OS 9 GUI was. �Pleasure� at its ease of use and the dawning realisation that �it�s not ME after all - its the bloody OS X GUI� and �Pain� at knowing I will have to return to the daily frustrations of coping with something inferior. As a graphic designer I am dedicated to reaching down to the core values of any process and building upon these values (through appropriate and concise symbolism and metaphor) as an essential, solid, foundation. So I find it ironic, after the years Apple dedicated to revolutionising the PC industry around its classic Human Interface metaphor, that the company is now complicit in encouraging a �user� evaluation and comparison of its two GUI�s as: Colourful baubles and dancing party tricks = GOOD, Neutral Grey = BAD. Still, the HUT (or HIT?) team will surely take heart from recent research which revealed that a staggering 50% of the millions of Mac-owners are STILL happily using OX 9 as their chosen GUI - FIVE YEARS after OS X has been available to them! This is clearly such a worry to Apple that its stated primary reason for introducing the cheap MacMini is to encourage its own user-base to �switch�.
  • Jeff - I�m speaking here simply as a Mac user. All I know is that I was very fast navigating my way around OS 9 and am considerably slower doing the same in OS X. I may be wrong, but I feel sure I noticed the same symptoms that I experience when watching Steve Jobs also struggling with the OS X interface. To me, that is a problem and I�m trying to work out what it is about OS X which causes this. There�s little point in you submitting reams on X11, relational database concepts, �recursive and hierarchical sidebars� etc etc if a system once worked smoothly, quickly and well and its replacement no longer does. The simple truth is that I - along with millions of other Mac users over the space of two decades - NEVER had any problems finding files, always knew exactly where to place fonts, never tampered in the system folder, and took the grown-up responsibility - you now feel we should be denied - of taking care of organising our desktop environments in ways which were familiar, through classical real-world subject/object associations, and worked best for us. Your manifesto is trying to sell sleek �play-it-all-for-you� Bontempi Organs to expert pianists. People who knew their instrument, valued its limitations, fully understood and loved the rational behind it�s neutral �clunky� appearance, took the trouble to practice their routines, and ended up as masters of their own instruments. By all means, let�s bring on the new tech and integrate it into that which already works. But PLEASE don�t try to teach your granny how to such eggs.
  • It sounds - from Jeff's description of what we can expect from Apple - that the 'Golden Age' of Mac human interface design is over. It seems like an irony to me that the 'Mac' name which set the ground rules for an intuitive, flexible, and metaphorical GUI - and originally promoted this (with great success) by focusing on the overly complicated and dictatorial routines of its predecessors, are now themselves in danger of moving towards a position of "you do things OUR way or not at all"... all blurred over with lashings and lashings of eye-candy. I could see this coming with the advent of the Dock... for the first time Apple had bullied its way into encroaching on my sacrosanct Desktop. Yes, I work FAST (or used to), perhaps users here like to cruise along at their own speed, but - even working within applications - OSX is far far slower than OS 9. Something interesting caught my eye when watching the Steve Jobs Keynote speech in January where our great leader sat at his onstage Mac to demo various new Apps (GarageBand etc). At first it didn't quite sink in... then I realised... as he navigated his way around OS X, Steve movements too revealed those subtle but familiar tell-tale signs of hesitancy, awkwardness, struggling to accurately pinpoint the cursor and - ultimately - trying to 'beat the unresponsive OS'. I'm not saying Apple shouldn't implement new technology. I'm saying there is a BETTER way of doing so. It's sometimes a pity that Mac enthusiasts don't feel confident enough in the Company to feel able to criticise it.
  • Jeff - it�s not such a big leap to recognise that the essence of any �real� office is nothing more or less than the information rendered on the thousands of sheets of paper which are grouped, correlated and stored (according to type) in various containers called filing cabinets, bookcases, trash cans etc. A Computer substitute for an office environment succeeds BECAUSE it doesn�t need to laboriously reproduce pictorial representations of all the office furniture... the original authors of the GUI thought about the essence of an office and recognised - as I have, and you haven�t - that it boils down to four elements: 1. pieces of information (documents) 2. the themed containers that information is grouped into (folders) 3. a collection of tools (programmes) 4. the �ground� on which I can use tools to interact with, and manipulate, both the information and its containers (desktop) It just so happens that the appropriate name for the �ground� in a working office environment is �Desktop�. But don�t get too stuck on this. In a football match the �ground� is called the Pitch, in the theatre it�s called the �Stage�, if you like driving it�s called the Road etc etc. What they all have in common is that they are the primary two-dimensional, boundaried, blank spaces on which we (the subjects) place objects in order to do things with them. I�ve been using OS X for a while now and I haven�t yet come across your mythical Desktop replacement called �Filing Cabinet�. If ever I do, it would seem as crazy and illogical as suggesting a football match should be played on top of the No6 centre-back. I hope this helps you focus on what a GUI actually is (and isn�t). By the way, a �trash can� is little more than another folder which - uniquely - has a big �EXIT� button attached to it. And speaking of EXITS...
  • Jeff - your attempted correlation of Screen and Desktop makes no sense and confuses two different environments. Of course a screen is a material part of a computer which is a physical object in the real world. What takes place within the boundaries of the screen is a completely separate environment with its own set of rules and its own limitations - all of which are made comprehensible by being closely based on object relations in the real-world. A necessary starting point for that relationship is that the primary object is a representation of a surface area called the �Desktop� onto which any number of symbolic objects - ALL representing the containers you mention (bookcases, filing cabinets, trash cans etc) - are placed. To simplify matters, most of those containers are represented as identical �Folder� motifs, differentiated only by their titles. And, yes, we can choose to swap between any number of desktops BUT they still remain (and function as) Desktops. Ce�i n'est pas une pipe A blank piece of paper - like a blank screen - is of no interest (and of no use) until an image is rendered upon it, thereby transforming it into its own illusion of an environment. It is how those images are rendered and organised which determine how suitable they are for our interaction with them. This is what we are interested in here. I believe that it is the growing prevalence of the kind of (mis)understanding you articulate here - of what a computer GUI can and can�t be - which is weakening the Mac platform.
  • Jeff - I am surprised to learn that my assumptions about what the OS 9 Desktop represents are erroneous. For a �good computer interface� to be good it needs to obey the same natural laws as the real world. It�s worth thinking about what the tech jargon �Graphic User Interface� actually means. From me it means drawn representational objects (Graphic) which a subject (User) relates with (Interface) - or in short: a computer space in which a successful Object/Subject Relationship can be achieved. Of course for this to happen, our objects (whether real or virtual) must be inert, dependable, recognisable and fit for the purposes we desire to use them for. A Desktop object (for example) can only be (or represent) a blank two-dimensional boundaried plane akin to a blank sheet of paper, a canvas or a clear table surface etc - onto which I can place further objects of my own choosing... each of which have their own boundaries and defined uses. A Desktop - for it to be a successful object - cannot pretend to be an office or a many-roomed house, or anything other that what it actually visibly represents, without the whole metaphor breaking down. To argue that this object actually exists within an office (or house), within a street within a town etc etc etc all the way through to the universe - and that its meaning can therefore be substituted and changed at will to represent of any one of these - is a woeful muddling of boundaries which results in the potential chaos OS X is flirting with. In discussing these issues it is tempting to draw into our frame of reference (or place on the table) the underlying mechanics of an OS - something Apple has clearly done with OS X and was careful to avoid with OS 9. In my view, these particular objects have been made too �public� by Apple as way of forcing yet more of their eye-candy on us. The unfortunate consequence of this is that it further looses sight of and undermines the OS�s purpose.
  • As this discussion is about GUI and not about how often a OS crashes - it concentrate on the topic. Jeff - �Fonts� is a good example. A simple (single window!) search on OS 9 would reveal ONE Fonts folder for the whole system (not THREE). How much simpler can you get than that? The OS 9 GUI worked as a design because it emulated a dependable real-world environment in which the �Subject� (the user) had complete freedom of choice in the way he related to �Objects� (his hierarchical organisation of containers and their contents within that space). Apart from a few (non-intrusive) system utilities within their own fixed containers, the space OS 9 offered the user respected this fundamental �Subject/Object� relationship rather than make itself an �obstacle� by attempting to interfere in, pre-empt or otherwise influence the user�s organisation of his environment. Compare that to the barmy OS X world where the �Desktop� container holds a �Mac HD� container, which contains �My� folder, which contains... wait for it... the �Desktop�! Click on that �Desktop� and it contains all the objects I�ve left there... except, bizarrely, the �Mac HD object�. Metaphorically, this Esheresque maze is like me entering my house, walking into the kitchen, opening the cupboard and finding...my house (with it�s kitchen, for some reason beyond me, GONE). Another way in which OS 9 had its boundaries very clearly defined (you know where you are with boundaries), is that its graphical elements always did what they illustrated. A clearly demarked window let you know - for example - where the scroll area begun and ended and its boarders both separated it from other information as well as giving you (literally) a useful margin for error when pointing the mouse. The scroll tab clearly indicated a tactile �grippable� object - rather than the completely inappropriate (slippery-looking) liquid lozenge of OS X. As I have already said, these �faults� (and many, many more) on their own don�t really seem that vital (just minor irritations) but added together they represent a seriously inferior GUI.